Surprise got re-tooled for '24, but it remains a condition that applies to individuals.
The revised Surprise condition imposes Disadvantage on the affected entity’s Initiative check.
Previously, Surprised creatures were unable to move or take Actions during the first combat round.
The main post has the technical details, commentary begins here.
The revised language leaves interpretation pretty open here, especially with respect to when the combat begins.
PHB24’s text mentions, then flinches, ambush tactics as an example. Ambushes are not really mentioned again, just a fleeting mention that seems to leave it up to a case-by-case ruling.
Any creature unaware of its foe at the start of combat has the Surprised condition, thereby rolling the Initiative ability check at Disadvantage.
There are a couple of questions needing answers: a) when exactly does the combat “start”? and b) is a party a single “foe”?
Let’s say a highway robber steps out from the shadows as a dozen arrows drawn by a dozen longbowers ignite, illuminating a ring of ambushers around your party. The robber steps forward, flourishing their rapier in a “hand over your jewels” way as flaming arrows are loosed. Your party can see all of the attackers, so no one in the party is Surprised and - probably - has already started planning for combat. Everybody rolls Initiative normally - but when do those loosed arrows start making contact? Remember, firing the arrows was the first overtly hostile act and Initiative wasn’t rolled until after they were mid-flight.
In this case, I think my ruling would be that the inbound arrows demonstrate an attack against the alert and aware party of heroic adventurers, so the combat begins the moment the arrows are loosed. A combat round is 6 seconds (won’t take that long for the arrows to travel) of simultaneous turns. The arrows will certainly arrive on their marks at the start of each character’s turn, so a Saving Throw is appropriate to avoid damage.
Next scenario is similar, but the robber steps out and no lights reveal hidden longbows. Arrows are launched from Invisible attackers at the backs of each individual party member, unaware of the incoming attacks. The party is aware of one hostile, but the combat is being initiated by undetected foes. Does the visibility of the distracting robber matter? What if they didn’t reveal theirself until after the arrows flew? When, exactly, does this combat begin?
Obviously this one is complicated, and I doubt there’s a satisfying (or even satisficing) way to codify this. To me, the robber’s visibility is a part of the ambush, drawing the party’s attention away from the arrows flying at its back. The party rolls Initiative at Disadvantage because the attacking foes are more unnoticed than seen. This combat is going to begin at the moment the party becomes aware of the attack: as the arrows either find or miss their respective marks, determined by a per-arrow ranged attack roll vs its target’s AC and resolved all together, before the first round of combat. Character feats that enable them to sense and respond to unperceived attacks should get resolved with the attacks.
Having seen it in action Sunday the new “surprise” is certainly a BIG nerf.
The unseen archers as you outlined are particularly odd but here is how I sus it out from the couch, sober, not in the heat of battle. Given, we have 0 way to mechanically deal with the arrows loosed RaW. I would rule we “begin combat” on the intention to lose the arrow. The attacker’s intention to loose the arrow initiates combat before the arrow leaves the bow - therefore their target rolls with DisADV on Initiative but that the arrow they intended to loose happens on their turn in the first round. Its a BIG nerf from before.
Moreover, an attack unseen to the back to a surprised target is exactly as effective as an attack to the front from a visible attacker. Thus, hiding for the ambush doesn’t really accomplish much at all from that standpoint unless the character is able to use something in the action economy to re-hide after the shot.
The challenge here being that what is logical vs RaW are tough to reconcile. I think the 2014 rule for surprise was more logical and just made sense. However, it likely overpowered thus the conundrum.
Now if we were talking about a surprise spell or something where the target has to make a Dex save to try to avoid it, I would be inclined to make a table ruling they would make that Dex check with DISadv. Though again that spell initiated combat. I don’t think it gets to happen RaW before combat begins.
That reading of it is not a nerf, it’s a total invalidation of ambush tactics.
Mimics, Piercers, Cloakers, and Gelatinous Cubes are rendered indistinguishable from ettins, combat is reduced to continental armies lining up to shoot in each other’s faces, dogs and cats living together…
I don’t disagree with your conclusion. To think Dagger heart spent $$$ to hire some of the folks who presumably had a hand in guiding the creation of this masterpiece.
I did a poll of the half dozen DMs at my office today (we lean into the stereotype). Based on the reading of rules 2024, WotC nerfed the ambush into oblivion.
One DM has a table rule that the action to initiate the combat can happen first but that player does not have an action on their first round of initiative as a result. He is still playing 2014 though and not played 24 yet.
Another noted that they might give advantage to the ambusher and disadv to the ambushee on initiative but that is the limit. RaW free attacks are a thing of the past.
I guess the take away is that cover is now a better bet than surprise in any case when considering the tactical situation prior to start of battle?
It seems that the consensus is largely against my interpretation and rulings, so I have to just accept that.
But I’m totally not going to - from now on, I’ll be declaring an attack on every trap that my characters trigger. That way I get to roll Initiative and have the possibility of completely avoiding the trap’s effects.